alt.education

On Apr 6, 11:09=A0am, buckeye wrote:
> veritas wrote:
> >:|On Apr 4, 11:52=A0am, buckeye wrote:
> >:|> veritas wrote:
> >:|> >:|
> >:|> >:|A simpler way of putting it was that Jefferson was probably a ston=
e
> >:|> >:|agnostic, disliked the clergy so much that if a clergyman showed u=
p in
> >:|> >:|a room with Jefferson, he would leave the room. =A0If you read the=
law
> >:|> >:|on freedom of religion written by Jefferson as a law in Virginia, =
you
> >:|> >:|will see the real bitterness he held toward churches and the clerg=
y.
> >:|> >:|I have read a few of his letters to his friends, and one to his so=
n-in-
> >:|> >:|law blasting him for leaving the Virginia law in committee to long=
.
> >:|> >:|He was so proud of that law, it is included on his gravestone, alo=
ng
> >:|> >:|with the Declaration and the founding of the University of Virgini=
a.
> >:|> >:|At the least, he was a deist, as were most of the founders. =A0The=
y
> >:|> >:|would not share power with churches.
> >:|> >:|Regards, Ken Hogan
> >:|>
> >:|> Much of the above is incorrect
> >:|Everything I said above is correct, I've read the letters, I studied
> >:|Jeffereson for many years, and his correspondence, and I am correct in
> >:|everything I said. =A0All you have to do is look up the letters, read
> >:|the Virginia law, and see for yourself. =A0None of them had any
> >:|intention of any church have any say in the government. =A0Jefferson in=

> >:|his private letters says it plainly, and Morris wrote him a letter
> >:|telling him that as a close friend of Washington, he knwe that
> >:|Washington felt the exact same way. =A0It's all there for you to read.
> >:|Regards, Ken Hogan
>
> Sorry, your comments are full or errors
> Jefferson was not agnostic. he was quite religious in his own personal way=
.
>
> He frequently gave money to churches and had a number of personal friends
> who were clergy. They visited him at his residence and dined with him ther=
e
>
> ***************************************************************
> You are invited to check out the following:
>
> The Rise of the Theocratic States of Americahttp://members.tripod.com/~can=
dst/theocracy.htm
>
> American Theocrats - Past and Presenthttp://members.tripod.com/~candst/the=
ocrats.htm
>
> The Constitutional Principle: Separation of Church and Statehttp://members=
.tripod.com/~candst/index.html
>
> [and to join the discussion group for the above site and/or Separation of
> Church and State in general, listed below]
>
> HRSepCnS =B7 Historical Reality SepChurch&Statehttp://groups.yahoo.com/gro=
up/HRSepCnS/
>
> ***************************************************************
> . . . You can't understand a phrase such as "Congress shall make no law
> respecting an establishment of religion" by syllogistic reasoning. =A0Word=
s
> take their meaning from social as well as textual contexts, which is why "=
a
> page of history is worth a volume of logic." =A0New York Trust Co. v. Eisn=
er,
> 256 U.S. 345, 349, 41 S.Ct. 506, 507, 65 L.Ed. 963 (1921) (Holmes, J.).
> Sherman v. Community Consol. Dist. 21, 980 F.2d 437, 445 (7th Cir. 1992)
> . . .
> ****************************************************************
> USAF LT. COL (Ret) Buffman (Glen P. Goffin) wrote
>
> "You pilot always into an unknown future;
> facts are your only clue. Get the facts!"
>
> That philosophy 'snipit' helped to get me, and my crew, through a good
> many combat missions and far too many scary, inflight, emergencies.
>
> It has also played a significant role in helping me to expose the
> plethora of radical Christian propaganda and lies that we find at
> almost every media turn.
>
> *****************************************************************
> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0THE CONSTITUTIONAL PRINCIPLE:
> =A0 =A0 SEPARATION OF CHURCH AND STATE
>
> http://members.tripod.com/~candst/index.html
> ****************************************************************- Hide quo=
ted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

He was also a political animal, and as so, would play a role. If you
read his correspondence yourself, you will see he may have believed in
a deity, perhaps, but he did not believe in churches, and especially
ones who wanted a say in the government. The one letter, to Madison
telling him about his answer to one of the churches hinting they would
like to be the "national" church is a clincher. Almost everything I
have ever read has stated that he could not abide clerymen, now if
there was an exceptions, I am not aware of it, nor their names. My
personal opinion is that he did not, as many of them did not, like
other people standing before them giving them orders. The last
sentence is just an opionion on my part.

--
Ken Hogan

--
Ken Hogan